THN.com Blog: Avs should properly honor retired Nordiques numbers

Michel Goulet had 548 goals and 1,152 points in 1,089 career NHL games with Quebec and Chicago. (Photo by Doug Pensinger/Getty Images)

Brian Costello
2009-10-25 10:40:00

The nice part about the after-glow of putting out a collector’s edition magazine like THN’s Greatest Jerseys of All Time is hearing the feedback from readers who get completely absorbed in the issue.

Louis-Pierre Smith Lacroix is one such reader from Quebec City. He had many good things to say about Greatest Jerseys and also pointed out what he thought was an error in the “retired numbers” section. Mistakes are bound to happen in a 170-page issue, but not this time.

Wrote Louis Pierre: “Right now Marc Tardif's No. 8 is worn by Wojtek Wolski, Hall of Famer Michel Goulet's No. 16 by Darcy Tucker and Hall of Famer Peter Stastny's No. 26 by his son, Paul, while J-C Tremblay's No. 3 has been worn in the past by such luminaries as Aaron Miller, Lawrence Nycholat, Karlis Skrastins and Pascal Trepanier.”

I had to check with the Avalanche to see if those numbers should have been termed “honored” – the way the Toronto Maple Leafs honor nine numbers, but still let active players wear them – rather than “retired.”

Nope, the Avalanche have seven numbers “retired” – Joe Sakic’s No. 19, Patrick Roy’s No. 33 and Ray Bourque’s No. 77, in addition to Tardif’s No. 8, Goulet’s No. 16, Tremblay’s No. 3 and Stastny’s No. 26 – but only the three who played in Colorado have them truly retired in the sense no other player can wear them.

To me, that’s just not right and somewhat disrespectful to the other four who earned the honor when the franchise was based in Quebec (from 1979 to 1995).

Avalanche senior vice-president, communications and business operations Jean Martineau, disagrees with me and says the organization does the utmost to honor the accomplishments of Tardif, Goulet, Tremblay and Stastny.

“We’ve honored all of their stats amongst our leaders, we recognize them in our media guides and we maintain their numbers are retired,” Martineau said. “But what they accomplished were for the Nordiques in Quebec and our fans here never saw them play.

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“When we moved here in 1995-96, we stated what we were doing (in terms of not having the four Nordiques sweaters hang from the rafters in Colorado and allow other players to wear those numbers) and the Quebec media was OK with it. And Michel Goulet worked in our organization another 12 years and he was OK with it.”

Still, that doesn’t seem right to me. If you’re going to honor their stats and include them among leaders, why not maintain that consistency and keep their numbers truly retired and hung from the rafters?

And I don’t buy the argument Colorado fans didn’t know the Tardifs and Goulets of the organization’s early years, therefore it’s all right to multi-purpose their numbers. I didn’t know Sir John A. Macdonald and there isn’t an American alive who knew Abraham Lincoln, but that doesn’t mean we don’t honor them as iconic figures generation after generation.

Also, for what it’s worth, the Phoenix Coyotes don’t allow any players to wear the retired numbers of Bobby Hull (9), Dale Hawerchuk (10) or Thomas Steen (25) from their Winnipeg Jets past. (Although Brett Hull wore his father’s number for five games late in his career.) Same for the Dallas Stars and the retired numbers of Neal Broten (7), Bill Goldsworthy (8) and Bill Masterton (19) from their Minnesota North Stars days.

When those organizations retired those numbers, they stayed retired, despite the fact the team moved to a different city. I wish the Avalanche had done the same.

Brian Costello is The Hockey News’s senior special editions editor and a regular contributor to THN.com. You can find his blog each weekend.

For more great profiles, news and views from the world of hockey, subscribe to The Hockey News magazine.

COMMENTS (15)

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hockeyben Posted
(2009-10-27 08:02:12)

Where do you draw the line? There was also a previous NHL team in Denver (previously in Kansas City and now in Newark, NJ). OK, so they probably never had any players whose numbers should have been retired, but what if they had? And does anyone else think that it was strange that when the Flames moved from Atlanta to Calgary they didn't change the name of the team?

sundowning Posted
(2009-10-27 01:51:59)

the coyotes did something that was pretty classy in the last few years, whats that? honour the retired numbers of players in the organization as the jets. IN WHICH, they actually had the jets players, Bobby Hull, Dale Hawerchuck, and Tomas Steen (i was there for all three) come to phoenix, and do the entire ceremony and retire their numbers, Duckys number 10 which was immediately changed out by a player wearing it, and the same for Steen's 25, and the unfortunate indignity of Brett Hull getting number 9 unretired so he can be scratched for 10 games and play 5 at no speed. But anyway, the coyotes retired the numbers of past and honoured them, something Pierre Lacroix should think about fully doing, if it wasn't for the Nordiques all the ignorant Avs fans saying the Avs shouldnt have ot honour the nords retired numbers, they wouldnt have the Avs, their cups, seen Joe play, or gotten their stanley cups

mr_william Posted
(2009-10-26 18:07:36)

I disagree. The Lanche should have nothing to do with retired Nordiques numbers. I always found it weird that Phoenix tries to adopt the history of the Jets and I'm glad Colorado has not followed the same path (although at least the Lanche have some of their own players worthy of honouring). I know it probably won't happen but there is a chance of Quebec City once again getting an NHL team. In that case the new Nordiques can be considered a continuation of the old Nordiques that went on hiatus. The Lanche would be considered an expansion team made of former Nords players much like how the NFL handled the Cleveland to Baltimore move and expansion. Then if Quebec City does get a team the four retired numbers and Joe Sakic's can be raised up in the new arena.

matthew_sawtell Posted
(2009-10-26 11:48:54)

Hate to blunt about it, but... Quebec City is a defunct franchise, period. The ownership in Denver, which I believe is different from the ownership from Quebec City, is free to do what it wants - much in the same vein that the current ownership of the Detroit Red Wings continues to use the number 6, versus the policies of the previous owners. Seen too many minor league teams come and go in places like Port Huron, Kalamazoo, and other cites in Michigan to see any of them handcuffed with this idea. Then again, other that the Fort Wayne Komets - who has undergone more than a few ownership changes - how many teams/leagues (major or minor) get a chance to last long enough to retire numbers?

hippomancy Posted
(2009-10-26 09:51:13)

There is a simple fact to be considered... the team has been relocated; tout fin. It is nice and appropriate that previous heroes of the franchise should be respected but the fact of the matter is that it is now, to all purposes, a new team. A new city, a new fan-base. There is an onus on the team to create a new vibe, a new history if you will, and it is not fair to limit players of the new regime in their possibilities. The tradition of the NHL is to retire numbers, and I recall the hullabaloo a few years back when a team 'un-retired' numbers (Boston, was it?), but the fact of the matter was that there existed photos of players in their prime, wearing those colors and those numbers. Show me a picture of Statsny sr. playing in Avalanche colors. And in that particular example, I like the idea of the son wearing the same number, though you worry about the jinx of living up to such an impressive dad. I however do like the idea of Colorado showing some consideration for the Rockies' heroes. The same franchise area, if not the same business group. So stick up a Rockie jersey or two. It's about the fans and the location, not the business letter-head... one of the few areas of hockey that operates on that supposition these days...

singollo Posted
(2009-10-26 09:43:38)

The more I think about this, the closer I come to agreement with ibleedblue: jersey number retirement is given out a bit too easily by many NHL franchises. There is nothing wrong with honoring a jersey worn by a good player who was a fan favorite, but the practice of retiring a number completely should be reserved for only the absolute cream of the crop for a given franchise. For example, J.C. Tremblay played virtually all of his prime years with Montreal, only joining the Nordiques for about 5 seasons when they were a WHA franchise. For this his jersey is so important to the Nords' history that it can't be worn again? For my money, the Pens do it right: the only retired jerseys in Pittsburgh are 66 (for obvious reasons) and 21 - which is more to commemorate the tragedy that claimed the life of promising young forward Michel Briere, just after his rookie season. I'd prefer to see it that way- in my mind, the only Colorade/Quebec player worthy of jersey retirement is Sakic. Keep it limited to the best players the game has seen, who gave their all for one specific franchise.

fcoc3rsg Posted
(2009-10-26 09:13:04)

Well gents/ladies memories are memories. I agree to have the sweaters of legend players hang up as they should be recognized for their deeds that they have accomplished with their team at retirement time. I do not believe in retiring the number though. Every kid growing up had a idol and you would proudly wear the sweater number of that famous hero of yours. Nowaday I'm looking at a hockey game and it looks like a football lineup. How far do we go with retiring numbers...until the players start wearing numbers above the 100. So it would sound like this...Goal score by # 103 assisted by #216. I realized that not all numbers of one team would ever be retired as so much to limit the choice of numbers, but take the Original 6 teams for example, the Montreal Canadien, how many numbers cannot be wear because of this right idea right now. If Vinny Lecavalier would come to Montreal will they give him the #4 that Jean Beliveau wore? No punt intended here because I think Jean Beliveau is a heck of classy player who endorsed that sport. I hear so many stories from my granfather and my father about his exploit Hey perhaps that's why Vinny does not play in Montreal...after all he always wore that number 4 growing up.

brian_kemp Posted
(2009-10-26 08:06:11)

It's pretty ridiculous to "claim" the stats of former players for the franchise, but to disregard the honor bestowed on the players themselves. "Thanks for being awesome for us, and we think your number should be retired, but only in Quebec City, for the Nordiques. Gee, too bad we aren't them anymore. Sucks to be you." The only number that should be worn out of the four "retired" sweaters is 26, but other teams have allowed the sons of fathers to wear a retired number (Hull in Phoenix), and I don't think Peter would mind Paul doing that, even if they were to hang it from the rafters. On the third jersey thing, can the Avs wear a third jersey in the old Nords colors, even if they can't wear one with the logos?

colin_187 Posted
(2009-10-26 00:17:23)

@mattdcat: The Jets players' sweaters are not retired by the Coyotes; their names and sweater numbers are hung on banners in a "Ring of Honor" under the press box. The numbers are retired but the sweaters aren't up there because the franchise understood that the only place the sweaters themselves should be hung is in Winnipeg.

markopolo Posted
(2009-10-25 20:57:17)

I hear you hands24, and perhaps my examples were bad, but my point remains that moved/expansion teams don't have to retire numbers of the previous franchise to "honour" them.... and to be honest, why should they? Colorado has done enough... more than enough in some cases.