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THN.com Blog: When will Carbonneau be recognized by Hall of Fame committee?

Guy Carbonneau played for the Montreal Canadiens and Dallas Stars over his 18-year NHL career. (Photo by Scott Cunningham/Getty Images)

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Guy Carbonneau played for the Montreal Canadiens and Dallas Stars over his 18-year NHL career. (Photo by Scott Cunningham/Getty Images)

In an era when goal-scoring is approaching a 50-year low, when even star players are admonished for not backchecking, when assistant coaches are mandated to find ways to shut down the opposition’s top scorers, one defensive giant continues to go unappreciated.

Guy Carbonneau is one of hockey’s all-time great defensive forwards, yet the hockey authorities on the Hall of Fame’s selection committee continue to ignore his accomplishments.

Since first becoming eligible for the Hall of Fame in 2003, Carbonneau has created nary a ripple of interest among the 18 voters, 14 of which are required to give a thumbs-up for a candidate to gain entry.

It’s convenient to induct the offensive gurus and goaltending greats. Superstars Mark Messier, Ron Francis, Ray Bourque, Paul Coffey and Patrick Roy among others in recent years made the decision too easy.

But greatness in the game of hockey should and does go beyond the obvious perusal of statistics. The defensive defenseman has been recognized with the induction of Rod Langway in 2002 and Scott Stevens in 2007. The goalie with the winning pedigree was recognized with Grant Fuhr in 2003, even though his statistics were far from extraordinary.

Even specialists and playoff performers have been given their due with the inclusion of Igor Larionov and Glenn Anderson this year, Dick Duff in 2006 and Clark Gillies in 2002. Players with injury-shortened careers? Pat LaFontaine in 2003 and Cam Neely in 2005.

So why has the defensive forward been given such short shrift by the Hall of Fame? Is it because defensive hockey isn’t all that exciting and is an element of the game the league has been making countless efforts to move away from? Would it be embarrassing to induct a defensive forward as the average goals-per-game dwindles down into the low fives?

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Guy Carbonneau was a defensive great for most of his 18 NHL seasons. He was a huge reason why three of his teams went on to win Stanley Cups. He won the Selke Trophy as the game’s top defensive player three times and was runner-up twice. Only Hall of Famer Bob Gainey can match that number of five times as a winner or runner-up.

To strengthen Carbonneau’s case further, his offensive numbers (260 goals and 663 points) are superior to Gainey’s (239 goals and 502 points). Gainey was once called the best all-around player in the world by Russian coach Anatoli Tarasov because he had the ability to both contribute to the offense and stymie the opposition. Carbonneau was much the same player a decade later. A true defensive great.

So if the league gives out an award for defensive greatness among forwards, shouldn’t the Hall of Fame recognize that greatness as well? It’s hypocritical that it doesn’t, especially in an era when attempting to shut down the opposition is the common denominator in the game plan of all 30 NHL teams.

Brian Costello is The Hockey News’s senior special editions editor and a regular contributor to THN.com. You can read his Top 10 list on Wednesdays and his blog each weekend.

For more great profiles, news and views from the world of hockey, Subscribe to The Hockey News magazine.

COMMENTS (59)

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habs in 2009 Posted
(2009-04-30 06:54:06)



Carbo was no slouch during his junior years (182 pts in 79-80) or in the AHL (88 and 94 pts) and he was a decent offensive threat in the NHL (five seasons of 20-or-more goals). But he was just that much better than anyone else at shutting down the opposition. I think personally feel that Carbonneau had the same effect on the defensive forward "role" as Patrick Roy had on the goaltending position.
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Maxime Posted
(2009-04-30 06:51:41)



Carbo, Hall worthy...but so are many others. Everybody makes strong points about wether or not he should be in, but many seem to forget the whole point of the article is to wonder why defensive players don't get as much HoF consideration than others...Carbonneau is only one the best defensive player to have played in the past years (or one of the best) and is being used as an example. It is true that coaches all want players to work on their defensive side, and yet, the NHL seems to promote the idea that you have to score 50 goals a season to be considered a superstar. Ironic, isn't it? Everybody that keeps on arguing wether or not Carbonneau is Hall worthy have totally missed the articles' point. And everyone who says Carbonneau wasn't part of a dinasty like other players can get something into their heads : the Habs are a dinasty in its history itself. Anyone wearing the Habs jersey has been, is and will have been part of a dinasty. Once your team reaches 100 years of pro experience, than you too will have the right to call it "a dinasty". Any other team can claim whatever they want, 10 years of being dominant is called being "a good stretch". If any team you root for reaches its 100th season without moving to Albuquerque (most probably typed it wrong), then we can start talking about a dinasty.
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Steve Cowen Posted
(2009-04-30 06:47:36)



@el duderino, I guess you are saying Kovalchuk is better then Gretzky, cause back in '93, Carbo was very successful at shutting down the great one. So the question is more would Kovalchuk ever get a shot on net, a few , but great quality chances would be unlikely. The comparison could be made between Carbo and Datsyuk. We saw a great defensive forward dominate Crosby and Malkin, even throw in Stall into the mix. (2 of those three certainly are better than Kovalchuk). So gimme a Carbo anyday of the week, and if you opened your eyes you would realize just how realistic it is .
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Steve Cowen Posted
(2009-04-30 06:47:21)



Gimme a team of Carbonneau's over a team of Kovalchuks anyday. The arguemant that anyone can learn to play great defense is a joke. Lets see Kovalchuk throw his body in front of a puck game after game. Not gonna happen . Or even play for the "TEAM" and not his own ego. And if there is any question over which will truimph. Look at this years cup finals. The pens had what were supposed to be the best 2 offensive players in the game. But oddly enough it seemed like Detroit always had the puck. And if you wanna compare that to Carbo, look back to '93 and see who it was that he was able to shut down . Carbo is certainley one of the games best of all time and deserves to be recognized as such. (And before you come back with well Draper..., I have no arguement against him having his spot one day)
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el duderino Posted
(2009-04-30 06:47:21)



@steve cowan, a team of kovalchuks would kill the team of carbos any day. carbo would never touch the puck, and even when he did he wouldnt be able to score cuz thats not what he does. be realistic.
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Angelo Posted
(2009-04-30 06:47:21)



@JacktheHat: True, Carbo played for Dallas with the guys you mentioned, except his legacy was not built around those guys, it was built in Montreal. He played a meer 5 seasons with Dallas and Hull, Lethinen, Zubov and Belfour were not there all 5 years. Players came and went during those Dallas years. Draper has been playing with the caliber of guys i mentioned his entire career. Are you seriously comparing Carbo to Draper? WHO IS DRAPER without those guys. Carbo was the man for the Habs. The 86 and 93 were won with strong defense, in which Carbo was the biggest factor...next to ROY. Draper won Cups with offensive power-houses. HOW CAN YOU COMPARE. Another classic case of jealous Habs haters who have to make an excuse. I bet Doug Gilmour deseves the Hall of Fame right?
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JackTheHat Posted
(2009-04-30 06:47:11)



@Angelo: "Carbo" also played in Dallas with the likes of Modano, Hull, Belfour, Zubov, Lehtinen, and Hatcher (who was still good). Those are just players I can name off the top of my head, and they aren't too shabby either.
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Naddad Posted
(2009-04-30 06:47:03)



So, Pat, in essence, you're saying that only skaters who put up big numbers deserve to be in the HOF? If you are not saying that, and you believe there is room in the HOF for defensive forwards, then you obviously don't know hockey too well because Carbonneau and Draper are among the game's best ever defensive forwards. Madden? I'd include him too, provide his game doesn't slip between now and retirement. He's a tremendous asset to the Devils' game plan and PK.
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Angelo Posted
(2009-04-30 06:47:03)



How in God's name are you comparing Draper to Carbo. Do you realize that Draper has always played with the best in the world? Yzerman, Fedorov, Hasek, Lidstrom, Datsuyk, Zetterburg, Schnieder, Rafalski, Osgood, and the list goes on and on. Who did Carbo play with??????????? Roy, ok Schnieder.............and..........well there you have it. everything that Carbo was, was done on his own. Draper became, what he became, because of the support he got from all the Detroit superstars. Draper is no Carbo and Carbo deserves the HHOF a hell of alot more than Draper. And by the way RedToronto, an offensive defensmen is more than just a role, its a title and the pinnacle to a teams success, hence 3 line 4 line.
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Devil John Madden Posted
(2009-04-30 06:47:02)



I have no problem with Draper getting in the HOF- as long as it rightly happens after my induction.
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