The Hockey News 2007-08 Stanley Cup Final Preview
Henrik Zetterberg and the Red Wings faceoff against Sidney Crosby and the Penguins in the Stanley Cup final. (Getty Images)
2008-05-20 09:41:08
Well, there you have it. The two most star-studded lineups in the NHL – yet ones people still wanted to write-off in early rounds – are set to do battle in the 2008 Stanley Cup final.
So which team to choose?
On one hand we have the Detroit Red Wings, the epitome of greatness and model of consistency over the past decade. The catch is, they haven’t won a Cup since 2001-02 and have found themselves on the wrong side of an upset more often than not in recent years.
With eight players still around from Detroit’s last championship season, can the new cast align themselves with Motown’s best, finally?
On the other we have the popular pick of bandwagoners, the Pittsburgh Penguins. Since their last Stanley Cup championship in 1992, the Pens have teetered on the edge of bankruptcy and nearly relocated their franchise. However, those years of camping out in the basement are finally paying dividends in the forms of Evgeni Malkin, Sidney Crosby and Marc-Andre Fleury, to name a few.
The Pens, though inexperienced compared to their Cup-chasing counterparts, are intent on returning to the crest of greatness.
Below you'll find a breakdown on the Stanley Cup final matchup and, coming off a split in the third round, THN.com's picks to win it all. View our conference finals predictions HERE.
DETROIT RED WINGS vs. PITTSBURGH PENGUINS 
NUTS AND BOLTS
Detroit - Home | Stats | Roster | Schedule | Transactions | Injuries
Pittsburgh - Home | Stats | Roster | Schedule | Transactions | Injuries
Regular Season Record:
Detroit - 54-21-7, 115 pts
Pittsburgh – 47-27-8, 102 pts
Playoff Scoring Leaders:
Detroit - Henrik Zetterberg, 21 (11G, 10A); Pavel Datsyuk, 19 (9G, 10A); Johan Franzen, 15 (12G, 3A); Jiri Hudler, 13 (4G, 9A); Niklas Kronwall, 12 (0G, 12A).
Pittsburgh - Sidney Crosby, 21 (4G, 17A); Marian Hossa, 19 (9G, 10A); Evgeni Malkin, 19 (9G, 10A); Ryan Malone, 15 (6G, 9A); Sergei Gonchar, 11 (1G, 10A).
2008 Playoff MVP Related Links
Detroit – Henrik Zetterberg. Aside from the fact he leads the Red Wings in scoring with 21 points in 16 games, Zetterberg is as proficient a defensive contributor as he is on offense.
Pittsburgh – Sidney Crosby. Sure, he’d probably like to have more than four goals in 14 games, but his skill and vision are key factors in elevating the play of those around him.
Why They’re Here
Detroit – Depth remains the Red Wings calling card. Imagine a team losing its top scorer (Johan Franzen, 12 goals) through the first two rounds and barely skipping a beat. It also helps to have experience and the Red Wings have plenty of that to go around, too.
Pittsburgh – Not enough credit is given to coach Michel Therrien, who has instilled in his offense-oriented team the value of two-way hockey. The Penguins don’t have the same marquee value on its blueline as Detroit, but the Penguins team defense is solid.
Special Teams
The Penguins rank second on the power play after three rounds with a 24.6 percent success rate, while the Red Wings are fifth at 21 percent. Both teams have an 87.3 percent penalty-killing efficiency rate, but the Red Wings have five shorthanded goals compared to one for the Penguins. Edge: Pittsburgh
Forwards
At first blush, one is tempted to suggest no team in the NHL has as potent a 1-2 punch as Crosby and Malkin, but the reality is, through the playoffs, Zetterberg and Datsyuk have been every bit as lethal; and they have more experience. Hossa has proven himself to be a valuable trade deadline addition, but Franzen can counter Hossa’s effectiveness if he is able to return to health. Although 19-year-old Jordan Staal of the Pens is a horse, Kris Draper and Kirk Maltby have the edge in checking experience. Edge: Even
Defense
There is no question the Red Wings have a deeper and more experienced blueline beginning with soon-to-be-named Norris Trophy winner Nicklas Lidstrom. Brian Rafalski is a two-time Stanley Cup winner with New Jersey and a solid two-way performer, while Niklas Kronwall, finally healthy at this time of year, is another two-way threat who likes to hit. Brad Stuart has re-emerged as a dependable D-man with the Wings. On the other side, Sergei Gonchar is unquestionably Pittsburgh’s best defender and certainly worthy of praise. After that, defense is done by committee. Edge: Detroit
Goaltending
When Dominik Hasek went down, the Red Wings were very fortunate to have a backup goalie many teams would love to have as their No. 1 – Chris Osgood. Given the fact he has two Stanley Cup rings already and was the starter when Detroit won its second straight Cup in 1998, Osgood has lots of experience, so there are no surprises for him. Marc-Andre Fleury, meanwhile, is new to all of this. He was 1-4 coming into this year’s playoffs, but has been nothing short of sensational through the first three rounds. Edge: Detroit
Coaching
Once again, if experience counts, the Wings are standing tall with Mike Babcock who guided the Mighty Ducks to the final in 2002-03. Babcock’s teams are fast, play a solid puck possession game and are very disciplined. It would have been easy for Michel Therrien to assess his talent and go with a strictly run-and-gun style, but he understands the value of defense and has managed to get that message through to his players. Edge: Detroit
X-Factor
Based on previous playoff experiences, we pretty much know what to expect from the Red Wings’ stars. But what about the Penguins’ top guns? This is, after all, just the second year of post-season action for Crosby, Malkin and Staal. Have we seen their best yet? If I was the Red Wings, I’d be concerned Crosby only has four goals to this point. He could be on the verge of exploding. Edge: Pittsburgh
Prediction
This has the potential to be one of the best Stanley Cup finals in years. Or, if Detroit’s experience is the deciding factor, it could be over in four games. Given the fact the Penguins have not lost at home in this year’s playoffs, we don’t see that happening. And when you have the best player in the world on your team – Crosby - that can also be a deciding factor. Pittsburgh in six.
Who do you think will win? Vote HERE.
Danielle Colen (Posted 2008-05-30 16:37:55)
Really? Pittsburgh in 6? Really? Sindy Crosby is the best player in the world? Really?
Tim (Posted 2008-05-27 08:55:35)
Should I get a broom?!!!!!! go wingsssss
Chuck (Posted 2008-05-27 02:35:26)
I only stumbled across this article/discussion tonight - while hind site is certainly 20/20 - wow! Lesser opponents from lesser teams have managed to take more shots, score more goals, and actually win more games than the vaunted 'top tier' Crosby/Malkin powerhouse. Obviously Z and Dats are not in the same class. It's not like Pavel has been a game star in each of the two games, not like Hank is actually on the score sheet. And apparently, Detroit has no depth beyond the twins?Don't worry pens fans, for 1- Detroit is only half-way there. That said, most of us Wings fans were in this same spot 13 years ago. We were the heavily favored offensive juggernaut that got completely demolished by a Devils team that played amazingly tight defense. Like I surmise many Pens fans (perhaps players and coaches, too) are guilty of, you've read your own press way too much, just as the wings did a bakers-dozen ago. Still, hold your head high - you're in the finals and you only have to win 4 of the next 5.
Mike F (Posted 2008-05-25 14:49:18)
Good point GTA Red. Wings were only .500 in their division this year. I get a laugh everytime someone squawks about the Wings easy division.
Besides...easy divisions or not, its Cup time where the regular season dont mean a hoot. Punch Imlach thought that way 4 decades ago...he did a pretty good job too. Though I hated the two wins over the Wings in the finals those years. ;)
RedToronto (Posted 2008-05-25 13:32:54)
And for anyone who STILL insists on recycling that old idea that the Wings play in a weak division, etc. As was already mentioned the Wings had it tough in their division this year...but if the Wings only won because they had it easy in their division that MUST mean their out-of-division record would be very weak, right? Hmmmmm, let's see...37-9-4. Oh yeah the Wings only won because they had an easy division.
RedToronto (Posted 2008-05-25 13:23:12)
If Moncrief is going to dish out the heat, he has to learn how take it too.
RedToronto (Posted 2008-05-25 13:21:55)
Too bad for you Daryl, the Penguins did not show up. Unless one literally means they showed up, as in they were physically present, then the Penguins showed up. Any astute observer could already see the Penguins resignation to what they are facing this series in the 3rd period. But hopefully the Pens win one game so I can go see the Cup clinching game 5 in Detroit. :)
The Penguins fast learners, yeah they learned so fast last year, that Ottawa knocked them out in 5 instead of 4. This is the Cup Finals, it is a new beast, and seeing how the Wings only cruised to the President's Trophy (and were only slowed down by injuries) the Wings must be slow learners, right?
The Wings still do not have a worthy competitor. The Penguins are and will continue to be outclassed in every facet of the game, too bad some people are just slow learners and will not realize that until the red jerseys ar skating around the ice with the silverware.
rob c (Posted 2008-05-25 10:44:37)
be careful not to choke on the wishbone moncreif or is kathy feeding you with a a bib on
Daryl Moncrief (Posted 2008-05-25 08:45:15)
Ok, I was enjoying a plate of wings with some friends when it became clear that they actually showed up to the game. Now we have a worthy competitor. Looks like this will be a great series. Although Monday will be very different from Saturday. The Guins are FAST learners.
rob c (Posted 2008-05-25 02:13:21)
almost too predictable, takeaways, face-offs, shorthand dominance and world class defense up and down the roster. If detroit did not spend most of the first period in the box things could have been worse for pittsburgh.
as the 35-40+ shot barrage continues as predicted fluery will continue to show his true colors and be good for at least 3-4 goals a game. As for line matchups you gotta love babcock when posed with the question who is your checking line and who will you play against cindy C. He replied my best checking centerman zetterberg. Hopefully the overexuberant pens fans are starting to get the picture of what elite means. I couldn't imagine in this decade of ever thinking of using cindy as my top defensive specialist. Hopefully for the good of the pens hockey team the management will try to refocus crosby's ever important media image and encourage him to take notes between periods on his rival Mr zetterberg on how to be a leader on the ice.
if this series goes more than 5 games then the wings truly felt like giving the pens a gift. Welcome to the west pens, unfortunately you only have three more or so to try to figure what is hitting you besides a strong west wind from detroit
by the way mom kathy this is a good learning experience in life for the young lad. better to learn on a blog what the true value of representing credibility and providing credible information is here then to get really blind-sided in the real world later on in life.
Kathy F. (Posted 2008-05-25 01:04:30)
You guys should lay off this poor kid Moncrief. He's just excited about his team being in the finals. For a tyke, he seems to know a lot about Hockey. He's just over zealous.
Mike F (Posted 2008-05-24 23:15:33)
Where is Moncrief? YOO HOO Come out Moncrief wherever you are.
You just witnessed a fine example of experience VS youth.
Fluery taking a coffee break getting over on the wraparound.
STOOPID line change.
Lazy in getting back during the Pens PP play.
And a assinine slashing penalty borne out of frustration.
Playoff experienced teams just dont do that....that is unless they expect to win the cup. And 7 shots in two periods.....they might as well be doing shots of Tequila.
carrera2s (Posted 2008-05-24 22:53:38)
mr.moncrief and co, i can't hear you!!!!! where are the haters? let's hear the excuses...wait there aren't any.
Mike (Posted 2008-05-24 17:41:04)
Moncrief, your lack of understanding about adversity gives away your youth and inexperience with life. Try to exercise some humility before your ego gets you into trouble some day. As for Dats and Z, two years ago Dats finished with 87 pts and was +26, while Z had 85 pts and was a +29.
Lance A (Posted 2008-05-24 17:40:02)
TO JIM WHITE - How can you say easy points an easy division... yes it's easy for detroit to get the top spot in there division because of the weakness but if you would have payed a TINY bit more attention to detail you will notice that they were 17-12-3 not very outstanding record in a really week division... pittsburgh was 15-14-3... so there were only 4 pts difference. Now I know thats not a good feature of the detroit team but it just shows that they are a good team and they don't just get the most points because of there division... chicago was the best team in taht division and they didnt' even make playoffs... as an avid detroit follower detroit was also below .500 in division play they still are if you count the 3 OT losses as just regular losses. Look up some stats before you start to beak
Bill Carroll (Posted 2008-05-24 17:30:23)
LoL! I'm glad there's people around to take the shots I'm not willing to take.
Mike F (Posted 2008-05-24 17:01:38)
Moncrief.....so your over on this page also saying things that just detail your ignorance in finer detail? I asked you before if you were on the couch smoking with Ryan Store. Obviously it must have been some "good stuff."
You more delusional than a paranoid schizophrenic. I would take particular delight in hearing more of your comments in another 10 days...but methinks you be nowhere to be found at that time.
Bill Carroll (Posted 2008-05-24 16:49:13)
Mr. Moncrief; First off I know my spelling isn't exactly perfect. And by the way, its Carroll. And yes, you do have to battle through adversity to be great. Hockey and historically speaking; in either case its nessesary. Thats why I strongly believe that the Penguins players like Crosby, Malkin, Staal, and crew will become better players at the end of this Finals tunnel. If we all thought they were good now, just imagine what a fire its going to light under them if they faulter in the Finals. The statistics are not the bottle line, its the little things a player can do to be great. Stevie Y is a great example. He did everything and then more, not some. Its even argueable that he's on par, or better as a leader than Messier. To say my arugement is nonsense is purely absurd because I have a basis of my opinon. Something I haven't seen out of you yet. And you can't be great just by winning. I could argue that Americanization (going the way of the Romains) has cripped this country beyond any real comprehention. When you're sitting in an easy chair using push button technology to destroy you're enemy's doesn't make you good, nor win, when you can't not screw up an occupation; even after declairing victory. Couldn't build leavies in LA, or countless other facts I could reach for and throw like American's throw opinons unsupported by fact. But Rome was defeated by their own aragance and stupidity many years ago to provide me with more than enough ammunition. And I would love to go back to Canada, applied and denied 7 times because there is a block by both nations for American exidoius emmigration. Sorta how its nearly impossible to get German citizenship if you're American born.
Daryl Moncrief (Posted 2008-05-24 15:02:44)
Bill Carol. What you say is nonsense. You do NOT have to go through adversity to be great. You have to WIN! That's it! Oh, and it's Therrien, not Terrian. I was born in Toronto, and moved to Pittsburgh when I was 2. If you don't like the intelligence of the US, why don't you move back so that the IQ of both countries will go up.
Daryl Moncrief (Posted 2008-05-24 14:56:25)
Hey Caz, YOU'RE NO PENS FAN! You just pose as one. Everything I have said is true and can be supported by facts! I did not say Detroit was a bad team, just that their two so-called stars, do not compare with Crosby and Malkin.
There is a difference between being good and ALWAYS being good! Dats and Z are good now and on this team. Move them and you will see them fall back to the norm. Go two years back and where were they. Back with the other players. There are always good players who peak, and that's Dats and Z right now. They have peaked.
Floridadogg (Posted 2008-05-24 12:18:15)
T shirts for sale at Flyer sports bars for the finals:
"GO WINGS VENGEANCE NOW"
Bill Carroll (Posted 2008-05-24 10:02:48)
Come to think of it; considering the Wings are back in Cup action, I hope we get to see the Flattiator Vladimair Fatisov again. Haven't seen him since their last Cup appearance. I hope he's doing well and in good health and we should all remember to respect him. He was that cool to watch play.
Billy Carroll (Posted 2008-05-24 09:38:17)
Oh boy! Todays the day! Its like Christmas morning; but you won't get your presents til 8pm. This certainly will be a fantastic series to watch. Its got everything you could want from hockey. Malkin, Crosby, Datsyuk, and Zetterburg will provide breathe taking action offense. Drake, Kronwall, Orpik and Malone will provide the big bangs. And Lindstrom will bring hockey excellence in suttle fashion. Two off the radar players I'll be watching and be very happy to see here tonight will be Chris Osgood and Gary Roberts. I hope this brings Chris the respect he deserves as a warrior goaltender that everyone figured would have been done by now. And Roberts has a great shot at his first cup since 89 with the Flames; something he was knocking on the door for with the Leafs for a few years. This'll be more fun than doing beers around the world at Disney's Epcot while being a few thousand miles away from you're place of employment! So get your friends and kids together and forget about the gas prices and have a blowout! Congradulations to all us fans that we're not watching the Ducks!
james dwyer (Posted 2008-05-24 00:50:24)
Penguins in six? Sheesh, I really enjoy reading the Hockey News, I've been subscribing for several years now, but come on. You were also predicting Dallas over Detroit. The Wings are focused, determined, driven, and deep -- far deeper on defense than Pittsburgh. No doubt it will be an entertaining series, and three cheers for that. As has been noted by others commenting here, how cool that two of the most highly skilled teams in the league are in the final. I don't care what anyone says, Anaheim thugged and mugged their way to the Cup last year and I don't know what the actual ratings were, but I couldn't get interested in that kind of hockey, and I always watch the Finals, whether the Wings make it there or not. But this year, the Red Wings will emerge victorious, and Nick Lidstrom will be the first European captain to hoist the Cup. Five games? Six games? Yes, perhaps... The real question for me is: Conn Smythe! Zetterberg?
Chris Schultz (Posted 2008-05-23 22:41:21)
No matter the sport, hot discussions like these are common. Since we aren't talking face to face it seems easier to be disrespectful to one another. That's unfortunate. It'd be great if we could all get along and post without flaming, but I suppose that's hoping for too much. Oh, well. Moving on.
I started following hockey while living in Grand Rapids, and was rooting for the Red Wings when they won the cup in 2002. Upon moving to Pittsburgh in 2003, I casually starting following the Penguins. The years after the lockout, the Penguins sucked so bad that I literally told my wife that "I didn't care if they lost, just that they played hard". Man, they pissed me off. Then they got Therrien. What an arse-kicker. Thankfully, the Pens finally had someone come in there and expect excellence from his team. Things have really changed over the past couple years, obviously helped by high draft picks.
The series will be great to watch. Obviously, I'll be rooting for the Pens, but I'm very well aware of the powerful Red Wings. Whoever wins, here's hoping for a 7 game series so we all can watch these excellent players ply their trade.
Bill Carroll (Posted 2008-05-23 22:33:02)
Marge, thanks for the comments. And yes, you're quite correct about my spelling.
Marge Simpson (Posted 2008-05-23 21:37:35)
Bill....you make a lot of great points. Be careful about bragging about your intelligence. While you can get your point across, your grammar and spelling need a little work. People would take your comments more seriously if you are more articulate.
JB (Posted 2008-05-23 18:33:26)
Moncrief- You cant judge how good a player is by when they were drafted or how good the players rookie season was. Zetterberg and Datsyuk might not have had the best rookie seasons, but they are still 2 of the best all-around players in the NHL.
Bill Carroll (Posted 2008-05-23 16:55:21)
I never do this, but in regaurds to DARYL MONCRIEF. You're just a little too excited and emotional for rational hockey conversation to make any valid opinon. Personally I'm scared to death of Datsyuk and Zetterburg because they have battled through adversity to because Crosby/Malkin calibre. Crosby and Malkin, though great players at such a young age; have had it beaten into their heads how great they are before they ever spent a second on NHL ice. If they actually had to overcome any major challanges to get that recognition than, well, they would be better players. But they haven't yet. After this Finals, if and when they lose, than we'll truely find out how great they really are, but not yet. Point and fact is, go check you're 12 year old school history books and take a look at your founding fathers. They had to overcome great adversery to become who they were; otherwise they would have all been great businessmen or local troublemakers just like countless other of the same people that we've all never heard of in history. Its times like these I wish hockey had nothing to do with American's what so ever. Oh, and I do live here (CT), but I'm just more intelligent than most people in a country ranked 72nd in the world in education out of 28 industialized nations.
Bill Carroll (Posted 2008-05-23 16:31:51)
As an avid Penguins fans since I was a kid (age 23), and living through the Detroit dominence peroid of hockey starting in the mid-90's; I'd have to say there is no more deadly an opponent to play for the Cup than the Wings team. There are two hugh factors here that could be the nails in the coffin for this year's Pens team. Postseason: They haven't been tested in a playoff style sense peroid this postseason. As a Ranger fan as well (Christmas people, they have most of my old player(s) including Jagr and Straka, and I can't change the colors of my cats because they were orange when I got them; and I get the MSG channel); Ottawa was a broken team free-falling at the end of the season. The Rangers will always be the Rangers despite worldclass play out of Jagr and Lundquivst-they will always be the retirement home of the NHL. And the Flyers...well I dunno what to say other than some AHL or CHL teams would have given the Pens a better run for their money in comparison. Mark-Andre: Fluery is a guy most Pens fans have watched for years and inconsistancy is a staple of his game (even against Philly if they would have gotten some pucks on net). Bottom line for Fluery is he cares more about making "flashy" highlight reel saves than intelligent, positional, non-rebound saves for his team. Too self-centred and he's only FINALLY gotten at doing exactly those sort of saves without letting them in the net. Most of Fluery's praise this postseason is based souly on the Terrian's coaching and the team's defensive awareness play. If I was a coach or a player on that team I'd be saying to myself and my team mates "Christmas, we need to keep the offensive preasure on and neutralzone locked down to keep pucks away from Fluery!" The play of Ty Conklin is my strongest evidence. No one comes into Pitts and plays like LaLaime except when they already know there's a goaltending liability. I'd hate to say it, but the Final is heavily in the Wings favor; even more so because they had to go through a REAL postseason battle every series. In warfare, what doesn't kill you makes you touch as nails. And the Pens are far from that acomplishment. But at least we (Pens) have a few more seasons to go at it because the cap system takes a huge chunk out of our depth!
Caz (Posted 2008-05-23 16:28:16)
I'm a Pens fan and even I think Moncrief is an idiot for those comments. I hope he is just trying to stir the pot. If not, I guess every team has their share of idiots including the Wings based on some of the comments in here. Zetterberg and Datsyuk are both elite players and the Pens are in for a tough series. The 2 best teams are in the finals and they should be an example to the other 28 teams on how to build a franchise in the new CBA. The Wings have assembled a great team with great scouting and late round gems and the Pens by being terrible for a few years and picking 1-2-1-2 at the draft. Don't say they tanked on purpose to get those picks. I had to endure watching them through those years. They were the victims of everything that was wrong with the NHL and they realized they couldn't compete when teams like the Rangers tried to buy their teams and offered huge contracts to free agents. They were smart enough not to bleed money and it is now paying off. I give credit to the Wings for winning their cups with a team built mostly from within. As for you Crosby bashers, I sense a little jealously. I'll bet if Detroit had won that lottery, half the Joe Louis would be filled with Crosby jerseys (which would be all of the fans - Zing!)
stevie wonder (Posted 2008-05-23 15:43:14)
skipped the trashtalk and do not forget its all come to an end at the ice.This is the stanley cup finals and there are now bad players on the ice at that level.come on lets face it crosby/malkin or dats/z? we will see who is the best between them about a few weeks.Do not forget hossa and franzen, they have been real hot since the playoff started.crosby/malkin is superstars and where first top draftround picks.dats/z where late 6 and 7 draftround picks, thats is a heck of a bargain in my opinion and they are also late bloomers that have been getting better and better of every year in the NHL.crosby/malkin have been stars from just the beginnig of there NHLcareers and they are going to be even better in the future and that is a scary mind for the rest of NHL.crosby/malkin have both won junior world championships,dats have won stanley cup and the russian league in the lockout while zetterberg have won a olympic goldmedal and the worldchampionship in the same year-2006,bad players do not win so much titles and crosby/malkin are going to win much more than they have right now.zetterberg won the rookie scoringrace in 02-03 but didnt won the calder trophy.gues whos won the trophy?A defensive defensemen who scored 3 goals in 82 games and played with mc cinnis. Its redigelous and a shame for NHL but he got the sportingnews rookie of the year award who is more value then the calder in my opinion because the winner is voted by the players.
Tom (Posted 2008-05-23 15:16:25)
Guess what I heard..... Crosby and Malkin are having wings for dinner on Saturday.
Mike (Posted 2008-05-23 14:51:35)
Josh Mcneil, name calling is for people who are neither articulate enough nor deep enough to have an intelligent conversation.
DDDDDetroit (Posted 2008-05-23 13:33:47)
Dats and Z not first Tier players? Are you serious? Barry Melrose has said time and time again over the last 5 years that they were the best line in hockey. The Wings have more wins in the last 10 years than any other team. Yeah, some of those wins were at the hands of Stevie, Shanny, and Fedorov. Z and Dats are THE first tier, as their young counterparts will soon learn. I think about the 20th time Datsyuk back checks and takes the puck of crosby's stick, they will know for sure.... good luck "first tear" pitt!
Daryl Moncrief (Posted 2008-05-23 11:13:39)
School let out early today, so I thought I teach you something I learned. A fact is something that actually happened, not an opinion about how the calls go one way or another. I guess I'll have to accept the comparison Michael wants to make between Sidney Crosby and Michael Jordon. In my opinion, both were 1st tier players in their own sport. Michael agrees, but seems to think both got an unfair advantage to win those trophies and put up those jaw dropping numbers. I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on that. As for Lidstrom, I haven't discussed him. Yes he is a first tier player, but I'm trying to get Detroit fans' head out of the sand regarding Datsyuk and Zetterberg--they are merely good 2nd tier players, having a very good year. They have played what... 8 or 9 years in the league? And now we hear about them? Lady Bing trophies are not for your performance on the ice--still a nice trophy, but c'mon... this is what makes them great?
JoeW (Posted 2008-05-23 10:36:53)
How soon the Pittsburgh fans forget about their team playing in front of a half-full igloo and the IRS padlocking their offices.They are lucky that the team is still there. So before you go ripping the attendance at the Joe take a look at your teams history. Just remember that NHL tickets are not inexpensive. I used to be a partial plan holder for the Flyers but I am tired of paying over $40 a game (reg. season and thats the Least expensive seat, they were $100 a seat if they had made the finals) . Also I have the Center Ice package and I always see a large amount of Red Wing fans at their road games. Philadelphia and Detroit always have huge followings on the road. I very rarely see a large Pittsburgh following at their road games.
josh mcneil (Posted 2008-05-23 09:46:54)
Micheal your an idiot. Crosby is overratted give your a shake will ya.
mike from windsor ont (Posted 2008-05-23 08:38:35)
Gordie As you sit in front of you,re chinese made computer, with you,re japenese made car in the garage and tell us about empty seats at the JOE and the embarrasement,Well mister we are out of work here and putting food on the table is the most important .But like the american auto,s and the wing,s We continue to put a high degree of product on the market. Yes there was atime that we could not compete, but now we are. It,s fools like you that cannot see the fine product that comes out of detriot, sports and auto,s alike. GOD BLESS AMERICA.
Jordon Emans (Posted 2008-05-23 02:09:38)
The media and the League should determine the captaincy on a team? Please tell me that was a joke? Nothing is more laughable than that. It really isn't up to you or anyone else except for those involved in the team to determine that, if you don't like Crosby then fine, that's your call. But you can't deny the turn-around this team has seen in the past two years. Hell, even in the past year. You can say all you want about how much Sidney whines or whatever, but the fact of the matter is is that the Pittsburgh Penguins are in the Stanley Cup Finals. If they get beat by the Wings, then so be it. I'm happy they made it this far to begin with. A main reason that Crosby is so disliked by fans is because he is so covered by the media, a fact that he probably has no control over, and if you do your homework...you would know about Gretzky's clothing line as well.
Wingnut (Posted 2008-05-23 01:58:56)
yeah, but that Moncrief guy is smart for 12! Don't you think! ;P
rob c (Posted 2008-05-23 00:17:19)
in comment to the fella who is taking about first tier...
zetterberg, datsyk - drafted 50, 100 or 100 something cant remember,,,
selke trophy finalists and both in the top 10 for scoring this year in the regular season and playoffs. Lidstrom and chelios something like 8 or 10 Norris trophies between them.
Junior hockey and a couple of seasons scoring points on a team that until recently could not define the word defense doesn't transform into stanly cups. Yzerman was scoriing 120, 140, & 160 points a season in a league that was twice as tough to play in as a little guy then the league crosby plays in today. if crosby played for scotty in the 90s and had to deal with the joey kocurs,Tie domi, basil mccrae, churla etc. The game is better for itself now that championships are not solely determined by the tough guys however stats especially scoring stats are relative to the era and to the coach style and team. As for junior hockey and where you are taken in the draft.......need one say more
In his own way crosby will be fighting the stardom syndrome trying to transform this into greatness the same way lindros fought this same fight his entire career. over hype and falling in love with yourself for too long in ones career does have its consequences
rob c (Posted 2008-05-22 23:51:06)
giveaways, faceoffs, takeaways short handed goals, 4 lines of stellar puck control and defensive play. Anyone who has been watching the the series in both leagues can quickly look at the higher degree of disciplined hockey that has been played by SJ, Dallas, Detroit and how easy the penguins ride has been. The wings and there typical 35-40 shost a game against teams better disciplined then pittsburgh will be gladly accepted by a team that spots if i am not mistaken 7 players that scored 20 goals or more this year. As for toughness detroit has shown it can beat teams that are far superior than pittsburgh in that department. in fact in this series perhaps the big boys could be the wings with the big hit meter running in the way of mccarthism, kronwellian and the big drake,,,not to forget stuart, cleary, homer etc.
Cindy will soon be reaching for his notebook like a good student should at his age experiencing the big show for the first time. If we was marginalised in Philly what will detroit do to him. Actually i believe malkin is really the key for them at least this playoff and as their end run to the playoffs demonstrated.
A penguin is a freak of nature the only bird that can't fly, the red wings need not worry. they faced much better goaltending in nashville and if the pens seem willing to continue coughing up the puck and give up as many odd man situations as they have in their playoff run to date they will wish they were back in NY, Philly or Ottawa.
If i was a Pens fan or the coach i would be listening to what tippet had to say after the series. Detroit is the most disciplined team in hockey right now to play against (meaning very few mental mistakes) and when you have "3 of the top 10 elite players in the world" (Z, Dats and Nik) playing for them it makes it tough to win hockey games.
crosby very talented however he has a few roads to travel in the maturity department before the C on his jersey really stands for something. If i was a pens fan i would be questioning why someone else on the team is not wearing the "C" Do you think Stevie Y was made the youngest captain by diving, crying and moonlighting as a fashion consultant with his own clothing line. The media and the league hype should determine teh captaincy on a team. Not sure if cindy is mature enough or there yet in the selfless department to lead by example yet. The "C" is more the numbers on the stat sheet. Leadership will be important if the Pens stand a chance as frustration sets in after the first few games....
Maybe sometime in the future crosby will teach the penquins to fly however this year no amount of global warming will get these birds off the ice and into flight
Raoul Duke (Posted 2008-05-22 23:20:33)
Hey Kaspar, didn't the Pens last win a cup 16 years ago? Do you think Nirvana is a current band? How is that less embarrassing than Detroit winning one 6 years ago? Also, Daryl's man-crush on Crosby is really creepy.
carrera2s (Posted 2008-05-22 22:53:59)
gordie, let's see 23 of the last 25 years including 17 in a row in the post season. yah that seems like underachieving if i've ever seen it. most successful pro sports team in north america in that respect. don't get me wrong i like the pens but at least the wings haven't held any fire sales or tanked any games in the seasons preceding big drafts (ie, crosby malkin) but have instead strived for excellence and fielded a contender year in year out. can't say that about too many teams can you, and shouldn't all true hockey fans respect that? i think you know the answer...
TJ (Posted 2008-05-22 20:52:44)
IM WITH GORDIE!!!
Gordie (Posted 2008-05-22 20:46:33)
To all Detroit fans - if you are really so confident in your team why can't you sell out the Joe? What an embarrassment. Not to worry though, Pittsburgh fans will buy up those tickets and make the road trip.
I guess underachieving every spring makes shelling out for tickets a hard sell.
Daryl Moncrief (Posted 2008-05-22 20:31:45)
This is an example of a first tier player:
SIDNEY CROSBY
2006-07 NHL - Hart Trophy (MVP) - Youngest MVP ever
2006-07 NHL - Lester B. Person Award - Youngest ever
2006-07 NHL - Art Ross Trophy - Youngest Scoring Title winner ever
2005-06 NHL - Youngest player to score more than 100 points as Rookie
2005 NHL - Drafted first overall.
2004-05 CHL - Player of the Year
2004-05 CHL - Leading Scorer
2004-05 CHL - Canada Post Cup (Three stars)
2004-05 Memorial Cup - Ed Chynoweth Award
2004-05 QMJHL - Michel Briere
2004-05 QMJHL - Jean Beliveau Trophy
2004-05 QMJHL - Guy Lafleur Trophy
2004-05 QMJHL - Telus Offensive Player of the Year
2004-05 QMJHL - Michael Bossy Trophy
2004-05 QMJHL - Paul Dumont Trophy
2003-04 CHL - Player of the Year
2003-04 CHL - Leading Scorer
2003-04 CHL - Rookie of the Year
2003-04 QMJHL - Michel Briere
2003-04 QMJHL - Jean Beliveau Trophy
2003-04 CHL - Canada Post Cup (Three stars)
2003-04 QMJHL - Telus Offensive Player of the Year
2003-04 QMJHL - RDS/JVC Trophy
2003-04 QMJHL - Michel Bergeron Trophy
2003-04 QMJHL - Paul Dumont Trophy
This is an example of a second tier player:
PAVEL DATSYUK
2006-07 NHL - Lady Byng Trophy
2005-06 NHL - Lady Byng Trophy
2001-02 Stanley Cup (21 games 6 points)
2001-02 Olympic Bronze Medal (2002-RUS 6 games 3 points)
1998 NHL - Drafted in the 6th round (171st overall).
Eric K (Posted 2008-05-22 20:13:05)
If I were the Pens I'd trade or drop Crosby (he is a great player to me) and get some solid D guys in return. I'd sign Malkin to some long contract because that guy is something special... more than Crosby to me.
Michael David (Posted 2008-05-22 20:09:39)
To TJ and all you Pens fans.Crosby is the most overrated player in hockey. Where was your team the last playoffs without Laroque to protect him.Crosby is just another good player and nothing great about him.He's just a great MARKETING tool.The flyers, sens and rangers wouldn't even make the playoffs in the West.Your celebtaion over the flyers will be the last one for a long time. Without Hossa and Malkin, Crosby wouldn't be on the radar. Wait till next season when the Pens will be broken up. You'll be on the outside looking in.
EricK (Posted 2008-05-22 20:06:08)
Zett and Dat are top level talent and nobody is going to tell me those guys are anything but. Crosby and Malkin are definately the real deal... amazing players but when you have a full blown team defense with everyone playing their spots on the ice like Detroit does... they wont be AS effective. They will be huge impact players for sure but not to the degree we saw against Philly and the others. Time and space is so limited against a team like the Wings... why should I expect any different. They shut down Modano, Ribeiro, Richards and Morrow... all excellent players in their own right.
Kaspar (Posted 2008-05-22 19:44:38)
Listening to the pro-Wing comments below you would think the 3 cups they won were in last 5 years!! They won their second 10 yrs ago!!! the third 6 years ago!!!If experience is all that matters then wouldn't Recent experiences have been failures?? Pens in 5
goleafsgo (Posted 2008-05-22 19:39:55)
goleafsgo
brian t (Posted 2008-05-22 18:34:05)
Based on these comments, it's clear that most people don't watch the hockey league, they only follow their own team. A lot of these biases are based on only seeing their own team dominate and the fact that these two teams haven't played against each other this year. I am a fan of neither team and am completely objective. I can say for sure the following: Detroit's team is REALLY good, they have 1 incredible line, a solid scoring 2nd line, and a very effective 3rd line. They also have an amazing defense and a solid goalie. Pittsburgh has great offense and solid though not spectacular defense. Their goalie has been great in the playoffs but has been labeled as streaky in the past. In terms of forwards, I think it's a wash. I think Detroit has better D. I think it's even in goal. Both have great special teams with Pittsburgh getting the nod on the power play and Detroit the advantage on the penalty kill, they're incredibly aggressive and effective on the PK. I think Detroit will win it but I expect to see tons of action and offense. I simply think the Detroit D is will limit more chances than the Pittsburgh blue line will, that's the biggest difference. I do think Pittsburgh has a good chance, but again, Detroit is the favored team by me.
JB (Posted 2008-05-22 18:19:50)
Moncrief-Crosby and Malkin have not won at all levels. Crosby, no cup and no olympic gold (ditto for Malkin). Datsyuk cup, Zetterberg Gold. and individual awards like the hart dont mean anything unless your name is engraved on the cup.
Mr. William (Posted 2008-05-22 17:31:03)
So the only areas where Pittsburgh is given the edge are special teams (that's debatable, the Wings are pretty deadly on the PP as well) and X factor (what does that even mean?) but you still predict the Guins to win 6? Can someone please explain that logic to me?
Wingnut (Posted 2008-05-22 17:00:04)
Zetterberg also is +15 to Crosby's +6, and has 5 shorthanded points to 2 for the next best player, Crosby has none.
Wish you all could spell (Posted 2008-05-22 16:22:09)
oh, by the way, Zetterberg tasted Olympic gold 2 years ago. He helped beat some teams to get that gold. :)
Wish you all could spell (Posted 2008-05-22 16:03:15)
Moncrief, you are obviously 12 and just got home from school. Honestly, if the Wings win this series, I will remember your comments fondly, knowing how stupid you will feel. Real hockey players and competitors respect their opponent. Otherwise they lose. I'm sure that Crosby is concerned about the "2nd tier players" on the Wings, and respects them. Take Lidstrom's (5 Norris Trophies with a 6th on the way) own comments on Crosby and learn how to live your life if you don't want to be a loser: "[Crosby]’s been three years in the league and won a hart trophy last season and when you look at him he is turning 21 this year it is really amazing what he has accomplished so far for only being in the league for a short period of time but he is one of the superstars in our league right now. We are going to have to take his time and space away, be close to him don’t give him the ice to skate on and find the open lanes with his passing. He is still going to find some open space because he is such a good player. If you have him matched up against Zetterberg’s line and make them play some defense and that is an area I think we can do good at him as well. You just try to be close to him at all times that is one of keys you have to do against him."
Mike (Posted 2008-05-22 15:43:09)
Seriously, Crosby is not overrated and Dats and Z are not second tier players. If your going to make predictions, you have to separate your head from your heart.
TJ (Posted 2008-05-22 15:28:51)
Skinny- Basketball is a competition? I thought that stuff was for girls? Clearly from the comments I have made it shows I know something about hockey. But yet your comment was comparing basketball to hockey, and then throwing the word "competition" into it all. And then you finished your idiotic remark by stating Fleury is an "unproven goaltender"??? What the hell sport have you been watching anyway? We're on Vs and NBC. Not TNT and ABC. Come back when you learn something.
Shimmy (Posted 2008-05-22 14:57:24)
TJ-When you learn something about hockey, than post on this site. You can compare hockey to basketball when the level of competition is so much higher in the western conference than the eastern conference in both sports. yOU Better pray that johan franzen doesnt come back and score all over your unproven goaltender.
Daryl Moncrief (Posted 2008-05-22 14:53:07)
First tier players get attacked by second tier player fans because their players don't measure up. Happened to Lemieux, Greztky, and now Crosby. Cry all you want, make all your excuses, he's frist tier, Zetterberg and Datsyuk have to settle for looking up at the greats--just like they will do in this series.
I Like Roenick (Posted 2008-05-22 14:43:50)
Daryl MonGREIF - take all your Sidney Cros A Baby posters off the walls of your bedroom !!! He is a VERY GOOD player. Micheal is right - Sid gets a lot of discretionary assists. Sometimes I think that he is sitting on the bench in Pittsburgh when the goal is scored and he gets credited for an assist. Time will prove that I am right when I say that Gretzkys records are safe and will never be broken by Sid. Especially the most Goals scored.As for penalties - how many "Diving" calls did Sid get called for last year ? He still dives but I think the officials are being told to not call them against the "Savior of the NHL" . Grow up, face the facts, and learn the game !!!
Daryl Moncrief (Posted 2008-05-22 14:33:33)
Second tier players are players who don't win the trophies but get nominated. They don't seriously contend for the scoring title but are close. That's Zetterberg and Datsyuk! Dats' Cup came cause he was along for the ride. Cup will be Pens this year and the Conn Smythe will go to a member of their team.
Go ahead and get out the cryin rags wings fans.
Steve (Posted 2008-05-22 13:55:16)
Hatcher and Smith are both completely washed up. Everything else the David brothers have said (notably the criticism of Crosby for not having "one" a cup by age 20, the suggestion that the Rangers are not a good defensive team, the claim that Colorado is better than anyone in the East) is ludicrous.
tluke53 (Posted 2008-05-22 12:43:41)
Raoul Duke,
Malkin is not eligible for "Free" agency for a long time. He is in his second year of his entry level contract. He can become a Restricted Free Agent after next season, but I am certain he will be resigned.
Caz (Posted 2008-05-22 12:17:02)
Michael - You should also check your FACTS. Zetterberg has never won a Stanley Cup.
Raoul Duke (Posted 2008-05-22 12:06:55)
Can you please explain to me how two top ten scorers and Selke finalists are second tier players? Say what you will about Zetterberg and especially Datsyuk - they fight to stay on their feat every play down the ice, which definitely isn't the case with Crosby. Also, can anyone tell me what Malkin's free agency status is?
TJ (Posted 2008-05-22 12:02:40)
Daniel David- I brought the Devils up so clearly everyone would understand why you, in particular, are so anti-crosby. All of your comments are about Crosby. Just admit you wish that you had a played like him on your team. And i'm not upset about your analysis that Detroit will win in 5, but the fact that you stated that Pittsburgh has not faced a good defense yet and Hatcher and Smith are washed up is why I had to comment. Don't even get me started on how you said the only reason why Pittsburgh has made it this far is because of George Laraque. I respect your opinion on your analysis, but your comments are so far off its not even funny.
Michael (Posted 2008-05-22 11:40:03)
Daryl Moncrief: FYI: Zetterberg and Datsyuk ALREADY have their "Stanley Cup" rings. Zetterberg's won Olympic Gold and the Worlds. "Z" and "Dats" play a tough, yet clean "plus/minus" game better than anyone in the league, bar none (and their stats back this up). As for their being "second tier" on any other team -- what Canuckle-geaded "Kool-Aid" have YOU been drinking, dude...!?! Let's turn this around to the facts: WITHOUT the Canuckle-headed Canada-centric NHL "marketing" (?) of "Sid the Id", Crosby himself is just a whiney, wimply, just-above "2nd tier" recipient of WAAAY too many "gift" points and "drawn penalties" via the NHL's "Sid Rules" policy. Without Canadian-player-favoring "Don-the-doughnut" Koharski calling Datsyuk (of all people, he who plays through hooks and practically carries players to the net) for probably the lamest and most unjustifiabe "hooking" call ever, "Z" and "Datz" and all the Wings would most probably be playing to "repeat" as "Cup" Champions this year. GET REAL, dude, and check your FACTS before you shoot-off with your clearly uninformed rants...
Just a thought -- separated at birth: Sidney Crosby (the sweet, yet cheesy "Kid" from the NHL season's version of "Canadian Idol") and David Archuleta (the sweet, yet cheesy kid from this seasons "American Idol")
Daniel David (Posted 2008-05-22 11:35:14)
To JoeW- As a Devils fan, I would not want Crosby on my team. He would bring too much pressure to the organization and he has not one a cup. He does not fit well in every teams system. The Devils consist of piecies to a puzzle, and I dont think Crosby would fit in ours.
Fred Bartsch (Posted 2008-05-22 11:27:41)
JoeW- I could not have said it better, I think you have HIT the nail on the head. As good as both teams are, I think that it will come down to play-off experience in the end. This (in MY opinion) will mean Detroit to hoist the Stanley Cup. I am by NO means either a Detroit or Pittsburgh fan, but I think Detroit's team just covers more areas. But one just never knows. If nothing else we the fans should be looking at a very good series.
Wish you all could spell (Posted 2008-05-22 11:27:05)
Mr. Moncrief...."Who's Datsyuk ever beat?" Well, he's got a Stanley Cup Ring. Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Malkin, and Crosby are clearly great forwards in this league. Your comments are idiotic. Why don't you open mouth and remove foot. Second tier players, ha!! I think I speak for many when I say that hockey fans respect Crosby but are tired of having him shoved down their throats. All you fortune tellers should shut up and watch the games, you are sounding like a bunch of ninnies!
Daniel David (Posted 2008-05-22 11:19:43)
TJ- Idk why you bring up the Devils in this. Im just making my analysis on the series and your just getting upset because I said Detroits winning in 5. Its a simple aspect, why dont you just stop sucking up to Crosby like he won you a cup and start worrying about the tough series your going to face. Its going to be a challenge it really is.
James Stephenson (Posted 2008-05-22 11:15:47)
This makes no sense. I do understand that it's been the popular thing to pick against Detroit for the past few post-seasons. But, come on, by your own admissions you guys give Detroit the edge in most categories that mean something (X-Factor is a useless thing that tries to quantify intangibles). The defense of Detroit is miles ahead of Pittsburgh's...and yes, their face-offs are miles ahead as well. They've dominated every team on face-offs. I don't care if Pittsburgh has "worked on it"...do you think Detroit HASN'T worked on it as well? Come on.
Just look at Detroit's plus/minus totals as well. Their forwards are much better at backchecking. I'm sick of everyone saying "have you seen Pittsburgh play?" and enumerating tons of reasons they don't know the team...well, I actually have seen Pittsburgh play most of the season and postseason due to my in-laws being from Pittsburgh, and I must say to you: Have you even seen Detroit? You do realize the forwards are a whole lot more than Z and Dats, right? You do realize that Filppula, Cleary, Franzen, Samuelsson, Draper and Maltby are ALL some of the best defensive forwards in the league, right? Sure, they don't score nearly as much, but they are extremely defensively responsible, and are very fast aside from Franzen. Don't even get me started about defense.
I'm not saying it's a Detroit blow out, either. It will be very close; but quit whining about how people discount Pittsburgh, while ignorantly discounting Detroit's play. They really ARE EXTREMELY CLOSE in skill level AND style of play. Detroit will take the long, hard fought series. And I only make that prediction because, yes, I'm a fan and will be heart broken if they don't win. It really could go either way!
Andrew (Posted 2008-05-22 11:15:34)
The best posts in this thread are the ones where some Red Wings fan proclaims that the Wings are the superior team, but the fan then goes on to say that the Penguins will probably win because Bettman and the NHL and the refs have already decided the outcome. Grow up.
JoeW (Posted 2008-05-22 10:50:30)
By no means am I a Pens fan but these people who are saying that Crosby is overrated apparently know nothing about hockey. The kid can play. I am sure that EVERYONE who posts comments on this board would love to have him on their respective teams.The only problem with him is the whining and crying. Once he matures and cuts out that nonsense and just let his game speak for itself them he will be best player in the game. Its called maturity.
Daniel (Posted 2008-05-22 10:50:20)
Does anyone remember that The Sporting News picked Pittsburgh over Detroit in the final at the beginning of the year? Just thought that was interesting.
A few other comments...
People who say that the Pens are lousy at defense and faceoffs have clearly not been watching them in the playoffs. They've improved tremendously in both areas. Their defense has easily been the best in the league during the playoffs (except for Detroit), and there have been several games where they've won the majority of faceoffs.
Roger (Posted 2008-05-22 10:47:49)
yes Ken you are right on the face offs.. I'm sure they are workin on that, considering that the Pens are a puck possesion team. Ya'll haven't got much choice but to seperate Zetterburg and Datsuk if yer gonna play a back checking game. Pens bc is way better than Detroits, got 3 tough off/def lines we can throw out.
I like Roenick (Posted 2008-05-22 10:41:16)
From the old days of Saturday Night Live .... Daryll you ingorant slut....
Cros a Baby is NOT a "superstar". He is a very good player whose vast majority of points come from assists. Put him on another team and he gets half of the assists that he gets now. Jagr has more GOALS than he does and Jaromir has been golfing for the past 3 weeks ! The idea is still to score more GOALS than the other team to win.
Rob M (Posted 2008-05-22 10:37:44)
This is to the goof who said the Wings have nothing passed Datsyuk and Zetterberg. Were you watching hockey on a black and white tv this year? No depth? Yeah having 4 lines that can score and back check harder than any other team, 5 really good defensemen and 2 veteran proven goaltenders isn't depth? Maybe the Wings should just forfeit now, don't you think? Pens are the team of the future no doubt in that (provided they can keep their players) but the team of right now comes from Detroit.
Ken (Posted 2008-05-22 10:34:05)
This will be a great series. But I think one of the important things that has been over looked if face off wins. The Pens are one of the worst face off teams in the league while the Wings are one of the best. Many will dismiss this as no big deal, but let me assure you this is HUGE on special teams. It's also important for a puck possition team. The Pens can't score if they don't have the puck.
Another point is the Big 2 of Detroit vs the big 2 of Pittsburg. Advantage detroit based on their defensive abilities. Datsuk and Zetterburg are possibly the best defensive forwards in the league. It makes a big difference at playoff time.
This will be a great series. I see alot of odd man rushes which makes for exciting hockey. Wings win in the end though
Roger (Posted 2008-05-22 10:27:07)
Is it Saturday yet?
Roger (Posted 2008-05-22 10:25:12)
Oh, By the way....
Pens in 6 Baby!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Roger (Posted 2008-05-22 10:17:00)
Yanno, it's gonna be an awesome series. Sid will step up, as well as several others. Detroit is a bad a@@ team. Detroit has some of the greatest players to ever play D. Detroit also have those awesome Swedes. Pens D has been overlooked all year till the finals. Pens are up and seriously coming. Pens will win this series, even if they don't, it'll be the best final in years... Let's Go Hockey!!!!!!!!!!!!
AJ Right (Posted 2008-05-22 10:11:45)
Ed, the Wings have 0 depth??? From the east coast are we? The Wings may have some of the best depth in the NHL. Most all of there front line guys have proven they can score even in the playoffs. Franzen, Holmstrom, Hudler, Cleary, and Draper. Names you hear on a daily basis not all for scoring but there amazing defensive work too. On defense any of these guys can score and now Kronwall and Stuart have proven to be timely big hit guys. The Wings have plenty of depth.
carrera2s (Posted 2008-05-22 10:10:58)
All these anti red wings comments. still saying that they're too soft, too old, please. and mr.moncrief, have you actually watched pav and hank play for the last few seasons? obviously not. there is no question that sid and gino will become the class of the league (with a few others) but right now zetterberg is the most dominant two way player in the game, period. and as for datsyuk he has the best hands and creativity in the league. like it or not they can both outshoot crosby as well. i'm not saying sid isn't great and i'm a big fan but the euro twins do things on the ice just about every night that seem unreal. that said i'm pulling for the wings but will be very happy just to be watching the league's two most talented teams battle it out. wings in 6....
Ed (Posted 2008-05-22 09:10:37)
And after Datsyuk and Zetterberg, what do the Wings have? Nothing. The Wings have 0 depth. Whereas the Wings have two excellent lines to worry about. Not only that, but Staals line isn't too bad. Better than the Wings second line. And after Lidstrom the Wings D is unimpressive. rafalski can be exposed defensively, which is probably why he is with Lidstrom. The Wings are built for the regular season.
BSwag (Posted 2008-05-22 09:10:06)
I echo the comments by many that we all need to calm down. That said, the one quality hockey fans have over just about all other sports is our passion for the game. It refreshing to see spirited conversation, lets just keep it civil. I have made several assertions throughout this Blog, but in the end I can see this series going either way. Both Detroit and Pgh are the best teams in their respective divisions so lets hope for a good series.
Ed Maher (Posted 2008-05-22 08:56:58)
Those of you who think that the East is weaker are kidding yourselves. . The Rangers play great team defense, they have just as much veteran leadership as the Wings (surprisingly that didn't win them the series), and they have a vastly superior goaltender. Philly is much tougher than they are given credit for. They are very physical, and they work hard. The Wings aren't nearly as physical as either Philly or the Rangers. The Pens worwards will be much more comfortable.
The Wings (and their fans) are in a for a shock. Wings fans will be shocked to find that Pittsburgh is just as good defensivley, if not better. The Wings are also going to get outworked on the boards and in the corners by a much quicker, grittier team. And Osgood is actually going to face some pressure. This isn't the Preds, the Avs minor league system, or a tired Stars team.
I think that the Pens are going to sweep.
Daryl Moncrief (Posted 2008-05-22 08:46:37)
Hey Michael Kramer. Who's Zetterberg or Datsyuk ever beat? No one. They are good hard working players having a good year... that's it! Crosby and Malkin have been superstars their entire lives. In Russia, in Canada. They have hardware to prove it too. Calder, Hart, Art Ross, Lester Pearson. They've played and won the big games at all levels. Zetterberg and Datsyuk? Nothing. These guys are in the prime of their career, they are not going to get any better than this. This is it, so enjoy it while it lasts... as brief as it is. Reminds me of two other players just like them. Drury and Briere. They seemed incredible last year. Two big contracts later on new teams and where are they? Briere was one of the highest point getters in the playoffs until he ran up against the Penguins. He managed all of one assist in five games. Drury didn't fair much better with the Rangers against them either. If you move Crosby or Malkin to any other team they remain on top in the league. Can you say that about Zetterberg or Datsyuk? They are second tier players at best, and will be exposed as such in this series.
TJ (Posted 2008-05-22 08:38:18)
To Michael David and his dumb brother Daniel- You guys are nuts. But now I completely understand where your coming from. It must really be hard being a Devil fan. It sounds like you guys are jealous. You all will never have a player like Crosby on your team because Lucky Lou will never dish out the dough. Must be tough. Your cup days are over. Talk about washed up, you guys dont have to look any further than your goal crease. And how can you say the Pens have played the weakest of playoff teams in years? I never knew Nashville was all that tough of a team. And Daniel don't ever compare a hockey game to a baseketball game. That should be the number 1 rule on this site. Dont ever compare our sport to a sissy sport. What are you a girl? Is it Daniel? Or Danielle? To say that George Laraque is the only reason why the Pens are still in the playoffs is the most rediculous thing ive read on this site all year. Your just a bitter devils fan. Stick to basketball my friend. Clearly you have no idea what your talking about.
Michael David (Posted 2008-05-22 02:16:20)
I totally agree with Daniel David. The Pens won't now what hit them by the end of the first period. The Pens had a very easy playoff playing against probably the weakest playoff teams in years. This is due to all the parity created by the CBA. All those fams knocking the Devils do so out of jealousy for our three cups.Crosby is a super hyped up player just for marketing purposes. Zettenberg and Datsyuk are the real deal. Wings in five.
Justin Sweitzer (Posted 2008-05-22 01:32:52)
Unfortunately for the NHL the Finals sometimes pits two seemingly unstoppable teams only to find that one team's will quickly imposes itself on the other, drastically abbreviating a series that many hoped would go 6 or 7. This is because of systems that great teams buy into and execute through good times and bad. A system that for that time period simply proves unsolvable. Who has the water-tight system in these Finals? Pens or Wings? In these playoffs no one has won games as effortlessly as Detroit has playing puck-control with relentless transitioning. Pittsburgh, while surprisingly efficient, have played great team hockey with a couple of highly-skilled tacticians for points. They have met great challenges but from teams that could not counter and force Pittsburgh to dig deep or change on the fly or between games. McCarty (or Draper) said it in the earlier rounds: whoever adapts the quickest wins. System? Wings. Adaptation? Wings. Before Pittsburgh can fully recover from the total setting and pace change of playing the Wings in Detroit the first European-born captain to raise the Cup will be smiling modestly as the man who makes the red machine run. Conn Smythe: Lidstrom, Cup: Detroit.
AJ Right (Posted 2008-05-21 23:08:45)
I honestly see Detroit doing what Philly did in game 4 of there series with the Penguins. Put a body on Crosby anytime hes on the ice. Someone who can skate with him and hit. Enter Draper. No more Crosby (or very little). A lot of people have great views on this post. I believe you will see great play by both teams and one team absolutly frustrating the other team. As long as there are no more nonsense goaltender interference calls on Holmstrom Detroit will win in 5.
Daniel David (Posted 2008-05-21 22:38:34)
And the reason why the pens are still in the playoffs right now is because of George Laraque. When the Pens were down 3-0 1st game against the Rags, they sent out Laraque and the series turned around.
Daniel David (Posted 2008-05-21 22:35:20)
Jim- I have nothing against the Penguins at all. I actually cheered for them in the playoffs when the Devils got eliminated (they did player flyers and rangers though lol), anyway, the flyers were a weak team, and the rangers were weak too but better than the flyers. The Devils totally outplayed the flyers when they played this year which gives me a reason to doubt them. The Penguins are in a whole new world in the east, playing a whole bunch of weaker teams, while the wings are playing against teams at a much higher level of hockey. This series is going to be like when the nets played the lakers in the finals. Yeah the nets zipped through the whole east but when they played the lakers in the first game they were down like 50-10 since the West was playing at a much higher level as is the west in the NHL is. Point im making is the Penguins are in for a real tough challenge, and fleury is going to have to be above and beyond his game if they want a chance.
tammy (Posted 2008-05-21 21:31:06)
Thank you . I finished reading THN's picks and was frothing, trying to get my thoughts organized so I could write a reasoned response. Then I read yours. You nailed it.
THN's picks for the Playoffs this year (at least) have been ludicrous. Yes, Sidney Crosby is one of the "Faces of the Future" of the NHL, but let's see him win a Cup before we crown him King. There is NO team that can stop the Detroit this season, but Pittsburgh is one of the few teams that will give the fans an exciting Final Round.
Go Red Wings!!
Floridadogg (Posted 2008-05-21 20:56:04)
Every team's fans (all 29 of them) that did not win the 2005 Crosby lottery or get to pick Malkin sing the same tune.......Crosby is soft and a sissy and Malkin is overrated....ad nauseum. I have seen countless interviews with Crosby and watched countless Penguin games on the NHL ticket AND I have watched over 3000 hockey games in my lifetime and I say all this belittleing of these two is sour grapes. It will be a great series and both teams play the game the way it should be played with speed, talent, and physicality. Congratulations to both organizations in advance and the same to the winner.
rob c (Posted 2008-05-21 20:31:08)
just to clarify i did suggest nashvile was a better team then pittsburgh rather to suggest that pittsburgh would likely have had more trouble up to now if they played against ellis in the nets and dallas and or San Jose.
i going to be watching the takeaways giveaways and the odd man rushes....pittsburgh will need to step up the D and discipline another notch to be successful against detroit. if they have half as many breakdowns and give aways like they had playing philly and the rangers it might not be a pretty series for penguins fans
Jim (Posted 2008-05-21 20:20:13)
Big surprise, a Devils fan coming out of the woodwork to badmouth the Flyers and Pens. Truly shocking....
TJ (Posted 2008-05-21 19:32:17)
Daniel David- Hatcher and Smith washed up? Your a joke. Like I said to steve Noble "learn the style of play, then speak the words".
Rob Arpoch (Posted 2008-05-21 18:37:50)
Seriously now, do you throw darts to make these picks?
You pick Detroit in D, goal, and coaching - favoring Detroit in 3 to 2 with the Pens, then pick the Pens in 6? You pick the Pens for special teams despite the Wings lethal skills when short-handed?
Detroit is to be worried because Crosby has had a hard time scoring against lesser teams? How is he to "explode" when playing a team that is so masterful at keep-away that he'll enjoy about half as much time with the puck as he did in earlier rounds?
No question this is going to be a brilliant finals with two exceptionally talented teams. Nothing will be easy for either team.
THN's picks and analysis are completely absurd, though.
Mike (Posted 2008-05-21 17:11:16)
I believe this series will be much more low scoring than people are anticipating. I wouldn't be surprised to see Babcock split his two Selke nominees, Zetterberg and Datsyuk, in an attempt to shut down the Pens big two. The pens will also have to contend with former Selke winner Draper, the leagues best d-man in Lidstrom, a headhunter in Kronwall and a very calm and underrated Osgood in net. The Penguins will get their cup(s), but this year the Wings will fluster them and teach them a thing or two about sacrifice. Wings in 5.
Daniel David (Posted 2008-05-21 17:01:58)
TJ- Rafalski and Lidstrom being compared to 2 of the most washed up defensemen in the NHL (Hatcher and Smith) be realistic please.
John (Posted 2008-05-21 16:49:21)
Raoul - before you said the Pens aren't a physical team, now you're comparing them with the Flyers of years past? It is worth noting the Pens struggled at times against defense-first teams (Rangers, Devils and Bruins). The "whose schedule was weaker" debate's amusing, but obviously both had easy paths. The obvious questions will remain until they play: does Detroit have enough secondary scoring and can they slow down both the Pens top 2 lines (Crosby's has 46 and Malkin's 42 through 14 games). It's a great matchup.
Wingnut (Posted 2008-05-21 16:38:01)
Should be an awesome series!! As a Wings fan I'm hoping the Wings win, but I think this one will come down to the razor edge of goaltending. Whichever goaltender plays better over the course of the series will carry thier team. Ozzie is probably the best non-"Vezina caliber" goalie around and I will take him. He's not getting a lot of shutouts, but he's generally not allowing more than 2 goals either. It'll be interesting to see if the Wings can outshoot the Pens by a 2-1 margin like they've done with everyone else, all season, all playoffs. It'll also be interesting to see if "the world's best player" and company can keep up their high flying offense against such a great all around team. If it's a blowout one way or another, then one conference will have bragging rights. But I expect a very close series where both teams could've easily won, but I'm not picking a winner. I'm going to watch and enjoy. :) It's great to be back in the finals!! Pens and Wings fans can agree on that!
Andy H (Posted 2008-05-21 15:10:19)
I think all Pens fan will agree Detroit is the best opponent that they have faced thus far. If Detroit fans dont acknowledge that Pittsburgh is much better than Nashville, Colorado, and Dallas then they havent been watching.
Steve (Posted 2008-05-21 14:23:16)
Raoul, Detroit is a better skating and, more notably, passing team than Pittsburgh has yet faced. Pittsburgh, is a bigger, faster, more offensive, more defensive team than Detroit has ever faced. That's the point. Both teams are complete, and any areas in which one is better than the other are only to marginal degrees. We have the two best teams in the Stanley Cup finals--of course they haven't played a team as good as the other yet. Like I said before, immovable object vs. irresistable force.
Raoul Duke (Posted 2008-05-21 14:11:25)
Detroit is a better skating and passing team than anything the Pens have seen so far, and Fleury hasn't had to hand upwards of 40 shots on goal per game. I don't like Crosby, but respect his talent. Malkin is sick and Hossa is dangerous too. They rely on these guys alot for carrying the puck into the zone and causing havok. I doubt they'll create the same space as they did against the New Yorks and a clearly tired Philly team. Detroit can also put 2 top notch defensive pairings on them. Kronwall is turning into a monster 2 way defenseman. There's something about the talk of the Pens which reminds me of the Lindros led - Legion of Doom Flyers team. They marched through the playoffs too, probably even more convincingly in terms of play. Alot of people felt that they would completely dominate and push around the smaller Detroit team and obviously it didn't happen.
John M. (Posted 2008-05-21 14:10:15)
I agree with Troy and Jerry. People on this blog are way too blinkered. I'm a Pens fan, but as a hockey fan, I'm just glad to see the two most talented and exciting teams in the NHL play for the Cup. I'm not making any predictions; but let's hope it will be a competitive showcase series.
Steve (Posted 2008-05-21 14:04:53)
Steve Noble. Hatcher and Smith are Pilons--there's no comparison between them and Lidstrom, Rafalski and Kronwall (Lebda and Stuart are not nearly as impressive as you or others suggest they are). Systemwise, the Rangers give up as little as Detroit (though no one on the Rangers can score) and, unlike Detroit, have a Vezina-caliber goalie to boot, so Pittsburgh has faced a tight, team-defense scheme, solving it thoroughly. I actually think of Pittsburgh's top three, Gonchar's the only guy in the same class as Kronwall, Lidstrom and Rafalski. However, Detroit's bottom three isn't as good as Pittsburgh's.
Dan (Posted 2008-05-21 13:53:50)
I love how wings fans are saying things like "Get real! The wings have this thing wrapped up we have more experience … blah blah blah .. Crosby sucks … refs baby him.. etc etc"
ahahaha ... that's exactly what the Senator, Rangers and Flyers fans had said only to find their self’s in complete and utter frustration before the series was even finished.
Won't be no cake walk, but penguin in 6 is a very fair prediction in my opinion.
Gordie (Posted 2008-05-21 13:44:13)
When you say things like Nashville, Colorado, and Dallas are better than the Penguins you lose all credibility as someone who may know anything about hockey.
TJ (Posted 2008-05-21 13:32:44)
steven noble- I did not know Lidstrom, Rafalski, Kronwall and Stuart were forceful shutdown guys. Considering thats what we were talking about in the first place. Do you not consider Hatcher Smith and Orpik forceful shutdown defensemen? Learn the style of play, then speak the words.
jerry (Posted 2008-05-21 13:10:59)
It's a game people, relax! Enjoy a great final because it's been a while.
Troy Martinson (Posted 2008-05-21 12:52:32)
The 2 most exciting teams are in the final, what more could a hockeyfan ask for. This series, in MO, will be won/lost in the neutral zone & special teams. It'll be interesting to see how either D handles themselves in their own zone. Crosby, like he always does will attract a lot of attention in Wings territory & continue to draw penalties. Hank & Dats are scary shorthanded as is Malkin & Staal.
The real question, from a historic stand point is this: Will Lidstrom be the 1st Swedish captain in NHL history to win a Cup or will Crosby be the youngest.....this Canadian is cheering for the latter.
Stay tuned
steven Noble (Posted 2008-05-21 12:43:33)
TJ, so you're comparing Briere to Zetterberg and Datsyuk? And Orpik, Hatcher and Smith to Lidstrom, Rafalski, Kronwall and Stuart???? Are we talking about the same league here because in the NHL these guys aren't even in the same class.
TJ (Posted 2008-05-21 12:32:18)
Daniel David- "Crosby and Malkin havent faced a real defensive force y